Jen, Amber, and Ali welcome you to the SAFE center podcast, Solidarity is all we have! In this episode, we give an introduction to feminism, talking about broad and specific definitions of feminism, and what feminism means to each of us. People with varying experience, or no experience at all, are welcome to listen to this episode. Feminism is for everyone and so is this podcast!

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Transcription of episode (provided by Izzy Martinez)

Ali Niaz
Hello, hello! My name is Ali.

Amber Thibeault
I’m Amber.

Jen Kosich
I’m Jen.

Ali
…and this is the “Solidarity Is All We Have” podcast ran through the SAFE Center here at CSU.

Amber
The SAFE Center stands for Survivor Advocacy and Feminist Education Center and we essentially support survivors of interpersonal violence, which includes things like stalking, domestic violence, sexual assault, things of that nature. We have two different office locations: one in the LSC and the other one in the Student Service building. We have confidential advocates for folks to talk to in the Student Service building, as well as a hotline that is open 24/7 and our LSC space is like a hangout space, so if any of y’all want to come in and do homework, it’s a great vibe. And we have a basic needs bar in both offices. So if you ever need some toothpaste, deodorant, or whatever we got that.

Ali 
Also say, I think we have the best stickers on campus. I think.

Amber 
By far, by far.

Ali
Yeah, all designed by our awesome and very talented graphic designers. So this episode is going to be an intro into feminism. Feminism can be a very complicated thing, from an outsider’s point of view. If you don’t really have any knowledge on what feminism is, or what it stands for, this episode is for you. We’re gonna do a little dive into what feminism is, what it stands for, discuss misconceptions and what you can do to become a more involved feminist.

Amber
Let’s first start off by defining what feminism is. I really like this quote from Bell Hooks. They are a really famous feminist scholar and activist. They defined feminism as a “movement and sexism, sexist exploitation and oppression”. You know, they’re a famous author and theorist who explores intersectional feminism, which we’ll get to what that is here in a minute. But it essentially looks at aspects of different identities, so things like race, class, gender, sexuality, and more. As far as what feminism looks like, it looks different for each person. For some, it is about reclamation of power. For others, it might be meeting basic needs that their community needs, you know, such as portable healthcare, such as access to healthy foods, you know, whatever that might look like. There are some people who think that feminism is only meant for white women or for cisgendered and heterosexual women, and unfortunately, some forms of feminism are exclusionary. There’s also this idea that feminism is just for women, which actually really isn’t the case, and we’ll kind of dive into that here in a bit. But everyone can benefit from feminism, you know, even men. Everyone can benefit from deconstructing aspects of gender norms and power differences. And, you know, there’s also this idea of feminism means hating men, and for some feminists it is, but for others it’s not. You know, it means being able to have the same rights as men. You know, for some feminists, it means having access to the same opportunities and experiences that men have. So, it really looks different based on who you are, what your needs are, and what you want your ways of feminism to look like. So throughout history, sexism has been used as a tool for exploitation and for power. Those in power tie sexism together with forms of oppression such as racism, homophobia, transphobia, ableism, classism, and more, to create a very intricate, tangled web of oppression and power. Those in power are you could think of them as spiders. You know, they have the ability to and the power to walk on and use those intricate structures and webs to their benefit, whereas people impacted by these forms of oppression are the bugs that are stuck in the web. They cannot easily walk upon it and navigate those structures the way that those who benefit do. Earlier, I briefly discussed the term intersectional feminism, or intersectionality, so let’s quickly dive into that. It is a term coined by Kimberlé Crenshaw, who is a legal scholar, and it examines overlapping social identities and how it creates layers of varying oppression and privilege. But intersectional feminism means that we can’t talk about one form of oppression without talking about others, because there are so many layers to undoing the spider web you know, that we talked about earlier. So I also want to quickly talk about the differences between the terms gender and sex, because they are actually not interchangeable, and this is a very relevant conversation to have right now, especially with some of the executive orders that we are seeing. So sex is a scientific construct based on biology. Whereas gender is a social construct based on social norms and expectations, and it actually does not mirror nature. So if you were to look at nature and different species of animals, plants and insects, they are not cisgender, and they typically are not heterosexual or monogamous. Science tends to support these predominant societal beliefs that nature is heterosexual, cisgender and monogamous, because this is what our society expects people to be. But that’s actually not the case, and a lot of studies that have drawn these conclusions have not been published because of fear of breaking these social norms. You know, it’s something that we tend to rely on as humans. Because it is a social construction. And some examples that I like are, you know, there’s male insects and animal species that perform mating dances. Male seahorses are the ones that give birth. Female seahorses deposit eggs or fertilization, and so sex is not a fixed category in nature. So why is it fixed in humans? And if you also were to take a look at a person’s brain, you would not be able to tell if they were male or female or intersex. Okay, but also, really quick, let’s talk about male, female and intersex versus aspects and identities of gender. So your sex when you’re born. You are either male, female or some variation of intersex. It essentially means that you have a combination or mixture of male and female anatomy. So it is its own category. Terms such as woman, man, girl, boy, non-binary, gender, non-conforming, and transgender are social constructions of gender and how people present themselves and how they want to make themselves known to the world. Gender is essentially how a person wants to be perceived. So someone could identify as a woman, a man, girl, boy, non-binary, transgender, gender non-conforming, and, you know, maybe even Two-Spirit if they also identify as indigenous or Native American. We also see that people tend to mix sex and gender. So typically, if you know a baby is born female, they tend to be socialized as a girl. But these two things actually are completely different, right? We’re socialized to tend to be what we were assigned at birth. When those two categories are actually different, and how a person wants to be perceived is entirely different than how they were born.

Ali
Yeah! Thank you for that, Amber. I’m gonna be talking about some broader definitions of feminism, diving into again, the bell hooks definition of feminism. Bell Hooks defines feminism as “the fight to end sexism, sexual exploitation, and depression, which takes a more in-depth look at feminism, and draws attention that feminism isn’t just a fight against patriarchy, but again, but also a fight against capitalism and the class system.” She was an advocate for intersectional feminism and criticized any feminist for being white centric. Oppression takes shape in many forms, and there are overlapping spaces of oppression that coincide with the person’s multitude of identities. So a core component about feminism is liberation, one’s ability to choose and to have agency over their identity and their body. Everyone should have the right to present themselves in the way they want to and to have agency over their bodies. This can mean a multitude of things for everyone and a different thing for everyone. Some folks may be more comfortable using they/them pronouns. Some folks may want to be sexually active, and some people only want to be sexually active in a relationship. But the important thing is, is that they have the ability to choose and to be comfortable in their decision. There’s a common misconception that feminism is simply an anti-men sentiment. In reality, as intersectionality has become a more widespread idea of feminism, feminist ideologies have also become more inclusive to men and their struggles. Patriarchal ideas have affected men and continue to do so, also contribute to men’s mental health issues, and on top of that, men are also oppressed by systems of class and race. Feminism is the fight against all of these things, meaning that it’s a fight for men too. I think something that’s at the heart of feminism is love. Not romantic love, but a love that chooses community. To choose love is to choose community. There is a lot wrong in the world, and feminism is about fighting against that, and community and fighting love with each other in spite of all the cruelty found in the world.

Jen
Next we’re going to get into some of the historical waves of feminism that take us through how we got to our current understanding. Starting with first wave feminism, which started in the nineteenth century, carried over into the twentieth. From about 1848 to 1920 with the Seneca Falls Convention organized by Katie Stanton and Lucretia Mott, signed the Declaration of Sentiments and had goals of affirming equality with men, and one of the major points noted was the right to vote. The right to vote was secured in 1920, for some women, but not all. It’s important to note that the women’s suffrage movement at this time heavily excluded black feminism. Like Sojourner Truth and Ida B. Wells and other women of color in general. There was also a lot of resentment and hatred towards black men who technically gained the right to vote from the 15th Amendment in 1870 before white women. Abolitionists that supported were turning their backs after this second wave feminism from 1963 to 1980. 1963 Betty Friedan published The Feminine Mystique, which argued that women were chafing against the confines of their roles as wives and mothers, which launched a second wave white feminism. In this wave of feminism, there were calls to end traditional gender roles and sexism and fight for women’s liberation. In 1971, the National Women’s Political Caucus was founded by Betty Friedan, Gloria Steinem, and Ella Abzug. Within this wave of feminism, we also have the Equal Pay Act of 1963 and the Supreme Court ruling Roe v Wade in 1973. Again, this movement failed to recognize black women and other women of color fighting for the same thing, who oftentimes felt isolated or separated from the movement. Also in the space of feminism, we had the emergence of the Black Panther Party. SNCC, which is the Student Nonviolent Coordinating Committee, and the Combahee River Collective. In the 1970s, CSU students identified a need for support surrounding sexual assaults on campus. So a group of students found a vacant office with a phone and founded our historic Victim Assistance Team hotline, completely run on a volunteer basis. Which then advocated for the creation of our Formal Center out of the Ethnic Studies and Women and Gender Studies College, we’re proud to continue running one of the oldest hotlines in the country. Next we have third wave feminism, which began in the 90s. This wave would focus a lot on sexual harassment, sexual assault, after Anita Hill testified before Senate Judiciary Committee about experiencing sexual harassment at the hand of Supreme Court Judge, Clarence Thomas. It would also focus on the shortage of women in positions of power. We also saw the year of women, when many women were elected to Congress. We also had marital sexual assault made illegal nationwide in 1993. In addition to that, we have the Violence Against Women Act in 1994 with Bill Clinton, which helps survivors of interpersonal violence and allows them to apply for housing protection. This is also a time of expressing sexuality and individuality and rebelling against systems of oppression and power. During this time, riot girl music is also born. Bands like Bikini Kill, Brat Mobile, Heaven’s Diversity. This period can also be seen as a more inclusive wave, as Kimberlé Crenshaw work on intersectionality began being introduced and discussed, as well as queer theory from Judith Butler.

Amber
Moving on to a more contemporary aspect of what feminism looks like, we see that these waves of feminism are not neatly packaged or addressed, and they change based on community and individual needs. We also see a difference in policies versus practice. There may have been a policy or a law that was created that should help feminist movements and feminist ideals and goals. But what was the actual reality of how these policies were practiced? So now that Trump has been re-elected and is back in office, we have seen a huge impact on not only feminist movements, but goals of what feminism is trying to achieve. During his first week back in office, he passed executive orders that made the Federal Government only recognize two sexes, and he also revoked the Equal Employment Opportunity Act of 1965; and also ended DEI programs within the Federal Government. So issues, so issues such as reproductive care, the gender pay gap. Some of the impacts of these executive orders affect reproductive care, who is able to get it and where they are able to get it. Some of the impacts of these executive orders affect reproductive care, the gender pay gap, and have also weakened legal protections for survivors of interpersonal violence. Also considering that he is not only a convicted felon, but an alleged perpetrator. So now to pose some questions for you as listeners, and please feel free to let us know what your answers are. On our Instagram, we have a new post, and our handle is: @safecenter_CSU. So we have two questions. The first one is, why do we still need feminism? And the second one is, what can you identify as things our community at CSU, or your community means to include in your feminism. Now that we’ve talked about some of the more mainstream definitions of feminism and the different waves of feminism, we’re gonna get into our definitions of feminism a bit.

Ali
For me, I feel like feminism has always been centered around love and community. I am a cisgendered heterosexual man, so I feel like I don’t have a lot of people with my identity that are very about feminism.

Amber
In this space.

Ali
In the space, yeah, but love and community, these things have always been things that matter to me as I was growing up, and I’ve always strayed from typical notions of like, quote, unquote, like, “what a man should be like”. And also, I always felt like I didn’t fit into spaces that men were typically in. And I always felt kind of weird. It wasn’t more outwardly like I didn’t feel like I looked like a man, but more internally, with my emotions and my sensitivity. I just felt like I didn’t really fit in. As I read more literature and I got more educated on the injustices I found around the world and things that are going on, and what feminism actually is, I realize that I’ve always identified with it before I even knew what it was. My identity as an able-bodied, cisgender heterosexual man, I feel like, there’s not a whole lot of people that look like me in these spaces, and I want to be able to change that and bring more men to these conversations. And you know, if I have friends people that don’t really care about these things, and I always bring it up to them, and always try to have these conversations with them, because I think, I think it’s important, and a lot of…it doesn’t affect a lot of these people, but I still bring it up because I think things matter. Things that affect, don’t you, things that don’t affect you still matter because they affect other people. Yeah, that’s kind of where I am with feminism.

Amber
I loved that, yeah. I would say feminism, for me, is fighting all forms of oppression, fighting for every single person, no matter your identity. Fighting for liberation and freedom for all. I also really like the idea of not having ideas forced upon you, right? Especially what we were talking about earlier, earlier. Especially with what we were talking about earlier, with the aspects of gender norms and like what you were just saying, Ali, with ideas of what a man should be like, you know. Feminism really benefits everyone. It even benefits men who think that they need to act a certain way, right? That is, that is an impact of patriarchy, right? Even though they have the most to benefit, it still impacts the way that they act, the way that they show up in spaces, the way that they present themselves. But, yeah, I would just say feminism, for me, is fighting for everyone and not being exclusionary.

Jen
In addition to what you have both said, which I heavily echo and agree with, a lot of what I would say is my feminism is a bit like what isn’t my feminism with? I grew up in a very conservative space. Albeit in California, top ten most conservative towns in the U.S. And I felt a lot of people understood feminism to be about hating men and thinking that women are better than men and that really isn’t the point, and that’s really causing harm to people feeling like they can identify as a feminist. To that point, also, as we talked about in like, the waves of feminism in our history. White feminism has become, what is kind of considered mainstream feminism, which is really harmful, and a true feminism is about equality and advocating for everyone, and like needs to be multiracial, decolonial, intersectional.

Amber
It’s also important too that a lot of the ways in which early feminist movements were made specifically by like white suffragists, were influenced by indigenous women and by women of color. So it’s really interesting that there are aspects of feminism that they picked out from these groups and then proceeded to exclude, exclude them when it meant the most.

Jen
And it’s also been co-opted in a way, where it was taken by white women to be that sexism is the ultimate oppression. It is the only thing that women can experience in terms of oppression, and completely erased any sort of intersectionality from it. Of women of color and what they were experiencing.

Ali
All right, so we just gave you all a whole bunch of information, bunch of historical context as to what feminism is. But in all honesty, feminism is what you want it to look like. It’s important to read and educate yourselves, and some good introductory pieces of literature to feminism are White Tears Brown Scars by Ruby Hamad. As well as Hood Feminism by Mikki Kendall. These are pieces of literature that dissect and criticize white feminism and try to bring in a larger conversation as to what feminism is supposed to stand for, and bring in the whole intersectional aspect of feminism. And then, honestly, anything by Bell Hooks is really good.

Amber
No matter where you are in your educational journey about feminism. One important aspect is having open and honest dialogue and conversations. Sometimes feeling uncomfortable, especially when learning about these issues, is really important, and it often means that you’re learning

Jen
Next, I just wanted to plug some of our other cultural resource centers. We have APAC, Asian Pacific American Cultural Center, El Centro. NAC, the Native American Cultural Center, B/ACC the Black African American Cultural Center, the Pride Resource Center. The SDC, the Student Disability Center, and ALVS, Adult Learner and Veteran Services. These are some great orgs on campus if you’re looking for a way to get involved. We also just wanted to say a quick thank you to our co-worker, Azaria, who was very heavily involved in the creation and research of this podcast episode. Who recently graduated. So we just wanted to say, shout out to Azaria.

Ali
Shout out Azaria.

Jen
We love you and we miss you.

Amber
Thanks, Azaria.

Ali
We miss you! And we’d like to thank KCSU for letting us record in their studio, for letting us get all this important information out to y’all. My name is Ali.

Amber
I’m Amber.

Jen
I’m Jen.

Ali
And this is the “Solidarity Is All We Have” podcast. Thank you for listening.

Amber
Doo doo doo doo.

Jen
Bye!